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The OTHER one - Gemini #2

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    #46
    Originally posted by F3ARED View Post
    NNeg on the fuel pressure, got the gauge but havent had the chance to grab an adaptor as the carbs are a metric fitting from memory, M7 x 1 i think it was? Am i missing anything obvious?
    Why are you fucking around with fittings for fuel pressure? Barbed T piece and rubber hose. Do it now. Before you do anything else.

    And take the fucking shit socks off.
    "Where can we get hold of a Vincent Black Shadow?" "Whats that?" "A fantastic bike," I said. "The new model is something like two thousand cubic inches, developing two hundred brake-horsepower at four thousand revolutions per minute on a magnesium frame with two styrofoam seats and a total curb weight of exactly two hundred pounds."

    Comment


      #47
      What he said.
      Also iirc these carbs cant deal with more than 2.5psi fuel pressure so you def need a bypass reg.
      Turns out, far too much has been written about great men and not nearly enough about morons


      Originally posted by seedyrom
      my neighbours called the cops...... not because of the sound of me working in the garage was too loud, but because i taped a cardboard box to my back, covered my self in vaseline and pretended i was a snail on their lawn

      Comment


        #48
        Originally posted by Jim View Post
        What he said.
        Also iirc these carbs cant deal with more than 2.5psi fuel pressure so you def need a bypass reg.
        Doesn't need to be a bypass reg, just needs to not be a junk reg.
        "Where can we get hold of a Vincent Black Shadow?" "Whats that?" "A fantastic bike," I said. "The new model is something like two thousand cubic inches, developing two hundred brake-horsepower at four thousand revolutions per minute on a magnesium frame with two styrofoam seats and a total curb weight of exactly two hundred pounds."

        Comment


          #49
          Originally posted by Gammaboy View Post
          Why are you fucking around with fittings for fuel pressure? Barbed T piece and rubber hose. Do it now. Before you do anything else.

          And take the fucking shit socks off.
          You know....i didnt think of t piecing it that way
          1978 Gemini Sedan - Powered by i change my mind every week
          1980 Gemini Sedan
          1992 Land Rover Discovery 200TDI

          Comment


            #50
            This thing continuing to be a cunt, well, continues.

            Ive done naught with this thing since easter as house reno takes priority. Finally rolled whats left of my other Gemini into the back yard under a cover and pulled this in to get it going again. First things first, swapped the alternator out for a known good one from my smashed car and re-clamped the lower rad hose into timing case as it has a light leak. Booked into a track day so I need to get this thing going again properly as ive entered both of us [mrs and i] so the car needs to be up to it.

            After much deliberation weve come to the conclusion that its the carbs themselves that are the issue and not the jetting. Ive said it before in many places but for the benefit of PFers, DO NOT KID YOURSELF AND ATTEMPT TO USE THE FAJS WEBERS - save yourself the headaches and just rebuild a genuine set. Weve thrown new [genuine Weber] needles and seats at it, adjusted float heights, checked floats for leaks/flotation, checked pressures, linkages, accel pump adjustments and a whole heap of other shit that i cant remember and the result is the same - it gradually trickles fuel into the rear two cylinders and hydros the engine, which leads to the shit-cuntedness running down low, over fuelling and a cylinder and sump full of fuel. We thought it may have been the tank pressurizing and forcing fuel past the needle and seat but leaving the cap off made absolutely zero difference besides a shitload of fuel on the rear quarter. We thought it may have been the carb linkages putting load on the rear carb even when closed and allowing fuel in - disconnected the throttle cable, still fills with fuel. Only other thing we can think of is it may have a pinhole or some porosity in the casting of the carb body somewhere allowing it keep dribbling fuel in. Otherwise, we are all out of ideas. Either way, results are the same - carbs are coming off and going in the bin and being replaced with something else.

            First things first though, im a bit concerned about the amount of fuel this thing has taken on. Being a fresh engine im worried that the over-fuelling may have hurt it and glazed a bore. Tried comp testing it in the driveway where it proceeded to shoot a whole heap of fuel out of #4 plughole, across driveway and 5m away to fence. Sump is full of fuel so dropped the oil and left it out with the plugs out to hopefully evap anything left in cyl. Pulled just over 6L out of the sump, which is fair going given that the sump on a Gemini only holds 3.2L without the filter! Rest was all raw fuel. Comp tester went on last night and results are....

            140 140 100 140. Fuck. :(

            Didnt get a chance last night to throw a bit of oil in the cyl and see if it comes up; if theres a spike in comp it pretty much garauntees the bore on #3 is glazed, if no change then it looks like it might be a bit wide in the valve clearance. Doubt it though as theres usually a bit of noise to go with the valve clearance being out of spec and theres no indication of that. Basically my only real option is to throw a working standard carb on it and go find some hills and put some real load through it and hope that it comes good. Otherwise, its engine out which i really do not have time nor inclination to do. Will hopefully get that on this weekend so I can run some k's through it and then hopefully get the thing to get some comp up.

            Regardless of what happens with the engine [wether i have to pull it to re-ring it/hone it or not], im not leaving it with a standard carb. Its not an overly-worked engine but its hopped up enough to make use of some more air/fuelling. Plus it sounds better and the standard Nikki 2 barrels are aids. Thought about fuel injecting it as I have enough left over bits to cobble something together and then decided I was making it far too complicated for a car I give no fucks for so I was having none of that.

            Plan A, and Plan B.



            Plan A is a redline side-draft manifold currently fitted with Mikuni-Solex PHH40s. Yes, they are the dreaded "Type T" version which means gasket kits are expensive to get and they rattle the venturis loose. No, they arent going to be worse than the garbage I had on there previously. Someone that knows what they are doing has had a play with these at some point as the grub screws holding the venturis in are loctited properly and it looks like the screws been machined to a slight point with a corresponding divot being drilled into the venturi, because they are located fucking tightly. Theyve also had some epoxy put on the bottom of the throat and been ported to match the manifold. Plan B is just yer-olde faithful 32/36 Escort/Cortina webber on a standard Gem manifold, but thats boring so will only go on if i fail [again] to get twin carbies working.

            Need a bit of a cleanup first however as they are properly manky...



            1978 Gemini Sedan - Powered by i change my mind every week
            1980 Gemini Sedan
            1992 Land Rover Discovery 200TDI

            Comment


              #51
              I know it's painfull, but random thought, with the rear FJAS off the car, chuck it in a vice to hold it in the correct orientation, and with the float bowl cover off, fill the float bowl with fuel and see where it comes out? if you can pin point the leak/porosity, you can patch with one of the fuel tank sealer epoxies.
              The Solexes don't look *too* manky, they'll clean up well enough.
              "Where can we get hold of a Vincent Black Shadow?" "Whats that?" "A fantastic bike," I said. "The new model is something like two thousand cubic inches, developing two hundred brake-horsepower at four thousand revolutions per minute on a magnesium frame with two styrofoam seats and a total curb weight of exactly two hundred pounds."

              Comment


                #52
                Have heard of porosity issues with these things. Be interested to see if it is in fact that.
                Rust is lighter than carbon fibre.

                My Italian 510

                Comment


                  #53
                  Originally posted by Gammaboy View Post
                  I know it's painfull, but random thought, with the rear FJAS off the car, chuck it in a vice to hold it in the correct orientation, and with the float bowl cover off, fill the float bowl with fuel and see where it comes out? if you can pin point the leak/porosity, you can patch with one of the fuel tank sealer epoxies.
                  The Solexes don't look *too* manky, they'll clean up well enough.
                  Not too painful, believe me im just as curious as you are. I fucking HATE admitting defeat so finding a fucking hole in the thing where there shouldnt be would put my mind at ease that it wasnt an inability on my [or everyone thats tried to help] behalf. Can i put some food dye into the fuel or kero just to make it easier to identify the source?

                  Originally posted by Guido View Post
                  Have heard of porosity issues with these things. Be interested to see if it is in fact that.
                  Thats what Roddy came up with when he did some digging. Hes just as frustrated and stubborn as I am given that he did over 200k and 10yrs on a Gemini with IDFs LOL
                  1978 Gemini Sedan - Powered by i change my mind every week
                  1980 Gemini Sedan
                  1992 Land Rover Discovery 200TDI

                  Comment


                    #54
                    Originally posted by F3ARED View Post
                    Not too painful, believe me im just as curious as you are. I fucking HATE admitting defeat so finding a fucking hole in the thing where there shouldnt be would put my mind at ease that it wasnt an inability on my [or everyone thats tried to help] behalf. Can i put some food dye into the fuel or kero just to make it easier to identify the source?
                    Kero would work, food dye would separate with petrol, would be fine with metho though. From the sounds of it, it'll be pretty substantial.
                    "Where can we get hold of a Vincent Black Shadow?" "Whats that?" "A fantastic bike," I said. "The new model is something like two thousand cubic inches, developing two hundred brake-horsepower at four thousand revolutions per minute on a magnesium frame with two styrofoam seats and a total curb weight of exactly two hundred pounds."

                    Comment


                      #55
                      Originally posted by F3ARED View Post
                      Thought about fuel injecting it as I have enough left over bits to cobble something together and then decided I was making it far too complicated for a car I give no fucks for so I was having none of that.
                      This is exactly what you should do, EFI is way less complicated. The ECU can be expensive but it's so much better being able to change anything with a laptop.

                      https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/THROTTLE...EAAOSwfe5dStdK
                      as short as possible

                      Comment


                        #56
                        Originally posted by bugle View Post
                        This is exactly what you should do, EFI is way less complicated. The ECU can be expensive but it's so much better being able to change anything with a laptop.

                        https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/THROTTLE...EAAOSwfe5dStdK
                        So, funny story about those throttle bodies. Engineering Performance = TurboGemini = Ben Wight from Ozgem days....which is where/who the fucking FAJS garbage that ive been pulling my hair out with came from!

                        Ive got two different plenum style EFI manifolds here [one 4ZE1 twin butterfly and one forward facing with an XF throttle] plus a spare set of GTR throttle bodies that can be adapted onto a weber manifold, plus a spare crank trigger, spare ECU etc etc. The issue is id be relying on Ricky to wire it, and id have to bust Steves balls to tune it and so on. Im running out of time and budget for this car for reasons I cant get into right now. Id actually reassembled the standard 4Z manifold [rebushed the throttle body, added air and coolant temp sensors etc] before things kinda changed. Might look at it again down the track by adapting the GTR throttles onto the IDF manifold, see what happens.

                        Howd you go with yours, did you get it sorted?



                        Wasted the weekend a bit but did get some spanner time on this. Turns out the compression issues were valve clearances - nothing jumped out as being "too tight" but after having two goes at it i managed to get all 4 pots to within 5psi of each other - number 3 came up from just under 100 to 138 which was good. I knew i was on the right track when #2 dropped to 90 because i fucked the clearance up

                        What wasnt so good is the plug thread on 4 has finally given up the ghost. Has always been a bit dicky and difficult to get the plug in and started properly. Got two turns in and felt it start to bind...ffs. Looks like its time to get the thread repair guys out.
                        1978 Gemini Sedan - Powered by i change my mind every week
                        1980 Gemini Sedan
                        1992 Land Rover Discovery 200TDI

                        Comment


                          #57
                          You'd hope the throttle bodies are ok though, just a butterfly and an injector, not too much to go wrong! Wiring and tuning a G161Z wouldn't be too hard


                          Mine is hopefully good to go soon, got the head o-ringed and resurfaced, redid the block o-rings properly, new copper gasket, had to move the valve guides down so that I could actually use stem seals with that cam. Changed to double valve springs and ARP studs. If it leaks i'm raging then putting some head gasket fix sealant shit into the coolant.
                          as short as possible

                          Comment


                            #58
                            Originally posted by bugle View Post
                            You'd hope the throttle bodies are ok though, just a butterfly and an injector, not too much to go wrong! Wiring and tuning a G161Z wouldn't be too hard


                            Mine is hopefully good to go soon, got the head o-ringed and resurfaced, redid the block o-rings properly, new copper gasket, had to move the valve guides down so that I could actually use stem seals with that cam. Changed to double valve springs and ARP studs. If it leaks i'm raging then putting some head gasket fix sealant shit into the coolant.
                            Would depend on the quality control in place at the factory manufacturing it. Given the known porosity issues with the FAJS stuff, if its coming out of the same place, id be a bit weary. Anyway, if i was to hypothetically throttle body this id adapt the GTR throttle plates to the IDF manifold and get injector bungs welded in. I really wouldnt attempt to wire it myself and although i could probably get it somewhat running and tuned before handing it over to steve to finish, i just dont have the time to actually devote to getting it done. Really need to finish the house now that baby #2 is on the way.

                            Saw you got it running on the weekend; glad you got it sorted. Still feel fucking terrible - and to think it came from a big, well known workshop!
                            1978 Gemini Sedan - Powered by i change my mind every week
                            1980 Gemini Sedan
                            1992 Land Rover Discovery 200TDI

                            Comment


                              #59
                              To just get it running with EFI the original manifold with the forward throttle body would probably be easiest?

                              You weren't to know how bad it was, but yeah i'm surprised a workshop could do such a bad job of a head/head gasket!
                              as short as possible

                              Comment

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