hydraulic winches

[XEFalconUte]

So I've bought a rear tyre carrier/winch bar for the 80. The kit arrives this week! So for something different I decided to go with a hydraulic winch instead of the usual electric. I chosen a Runva 12000lb model.

The winch needs:

11Mpa/1600psi of pressure
11.9G per min/45L per min of flow
for 17.1 ft per min/5.2m per min of line speed

The power steering pump has got no hope of keeping up so I'm looking at a dedicated clutch pump to run this and possibly later a front hydraulic winch. The mighty 1hz produces its maximium torque at 2,200 rpm so I think this will be a good point so shoot for.

I'll quite freely admit the most experience I've had with hydraulics is pressing the brake pedal in the Landcruiser, though I'm willing to learn....

The winch came with a 12v electric solenoid valve block and as far as I can tell it's either all on or all off (no half speed like when lowering the load on a forklift where you can change the rate of decent).

Is there a valve block avaliable that could do that? with a wired remote?

I understand the reservoir has to gravity feed the pump, but what about capacity? I've been told for 100% duty cycle you need to have 3 times the flow rate of the pump, but 135L of oil sounds excessive to me....

The next problem I've struck is sizing the clutch pump, i've found these Muncie clutch pumps here according to the flow chart I could use the PH5 model and be close on the money for flow at 2200rpm but what about the pressure?

any help would be appreciated

thanks

Simon

[nine2nine]

Can't help you other then was talking to a guy with a monster of a hydraulic winch set up with the pump running off his transfer and from memory he 30L fluid reserviour and a oil cooler.

[GSRman]

I'm guessing your cruiser doesn't have a PTO?

[da9jeff]

forklifts use a manual selector valve, hence how you can control fluid flow. So if u want that you will need to sacrifice the remote. Maybe look at small tractor hyd pumps?

[XEFalconUte]

The 80 series , being a pov pack standard model does have a pto drive that bolts to the transfer. The reason I want to use a clutch pump running off of the engine is so I can drive, select gears to match the amount of slip and use the clutch without unloading the winch. Another reason is the standard pto drive is mounted to the transfer and able to spin backward, if I tried to drive in reverse while winching backward, the pump would be spun backwards also. I can't see this being a good thing...

Simon

[thechuckster]

A remote-wired control block (that does variable pressure) would be PWM controlled and costly.

Have seen several old-school tractors re-fitted with larger hydraulic pumps to drive extra hardware - dual v-belt drive off the crank snout (tho one was a chain drive off the fuel-pump shaft), rubber isolation/coupler inline from pulley to pump body (so if the pump seized, it wouldn't smash other stuff), over-sized fluid reservoir and cooler block/radiator covered with a thermofan that ran 100%.

My brother's previous work ute (had a small hydraulically-driven drill rig on it) ran with hefty-sized pump bolted onto the PTO but they obviously only used the pump with ute stationary.

If you ran off the PTO on the back of the transfer box, you could include a ratchet clutch that disengaged the pump if you went backwards?

[GSRman]

If you ran off the PTO on the back of the transfer box, you could include a ratchet clutch that disengaged the pump if you went backwards?

except if he wants to winch backwards... where the winch will be.

[Tripper]

we have a small remote controlled excavator for use in confined spaces, and the remote has joysticks that have positions that control how fast the selected function happens. I have no idea on how it works on the hydraulic sides of things and can only make a guess that it uses different size valves for each position. eg position 1 = small valve and so forth up to the last position

[15UZU]

ok, main problem with PTO from the box is most set ups are driven from the neutral position of the transfer box. to use it you need put the main box in neutral,select what would normally be 4wd neutral in the transfer box, then put the main box back in gear. positive - by selecting a different gear in the main box you can generate more winch speed from less engine revs, negative- can`t use the wheels to help pull it out of whatever bog hole you get stuck in

- can winch all day long and not overheat the winch or burn out the solenoid. don`t be worried too much about the hyd oil temps if you`re winching long enough to get the oil disturbingly hot then its probably the least of your problems.
con - running high pressure hyd oil lines under the body,mounting an oil tank and making shit work
pro- usually carry more wire rope than an equivalent electric winch
con- weight
pro - doesn`t kill the batteries
con- engine has to be running,won`t pull it back onto its wheels from laying on its side or roof,again if it gets to that stage you have bigger problems to worry about
pro - reliability if done properly
con - cost

i`ve got a 10000lb planetary drive superwinch on the hilux,went with a second hand eaton hyd. pump from truck wrecking yard, running off the gearbox PTO (not a standard hilux gearbox,already had pto fitted, hooked up a pneumatic ram set up to engage/disengage it),but i`ve seen them hooked up to the air actuated clutch from a horton fan from a truck engine driven off a multi-rib belt. it worked pretty good but with the winch really pulling and some mud/water in the mix belt slip was an issue,as was breaking mounting brackets,40+hp of load from the pump needs some pretty decent brackets&mounts

with the compressor&air tank already set up on the hilux i couldn`t resist making the most of it and went remote control (PROPER remote control,wireless!) and air actuators mounted in a water tight section of the toolbox,away from water and shit,very similar set up to most late model tow trucks but with less circuits,one of the buttons on the remote flicks a solenoid to charge a pneumatic ram on the fuel lever of the injector pump,brings the engine rpm up to wherever its set to go to. keep in mind,leaving the pump pumping and not in use heats the oil in the tank up much quicker,super quick if the pump speed/engine revs are up at the time as its still pumping the oil and returning it straight to the tank.mine has no cooler in the system,the tank gets too hot to hold your hand on but its never been a problem. if its not boiling its fine.roasts mud quite well too

hyd oil tank is mounted under the tray with the breather up at roof level behind the cab,next to the breather hoses for the diffs,box etc. i`ve got a smaller electric winch at the back of the chassis under the tray just for added insurance,sometimes winching out backwards is much easier than winching in deeper going forwards

[15UZU]

the variable flow side of things is piss easy,if the control lever is only 1/2 open, the orifice controlling the flow is only half open. just means less voltage at the solenoid pushing the flow control valve open a smaller distance letting a smaller volume of oil into the circuit

also, turning hydraulic pumps backwards is incredibly nasty,all that will happen is expensive sounding noises and a fucked pump within a few seconds

[JohnMcSandyVag]

There's being different and there's why the fuck? Electric is so bloody simple, I don't know why you'd get something that's such a head fuck to setup. Was it super extra cheap or did you have it sitting around somewhere?