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Thread: Microsquirt - Super Tight Budget EFI - Datsun L20B- Anyone got experience?

  1. #121
    Purist, whats that? Jason Broadhurst's Avatar
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    They had to change injectors because number one was not firing. Thats the last of it I heard.
    Jason Broadhurst

    Someone once asked me if they could use my mower. I said "sure, so long as it doesn't leave my yard"

  2. #122
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    So after some fucking around today we got it started.

    If the Megasquirt/Microsquirt has a flaw it is the lack of cohesive information and documentation.

    I adjusted some setting that I don't know what it does and fiddled with the ignition pickup offset and go it started. The scaling for the map sensor is way off, so it was really rich with revs but sounded great regardless.

    This week I will continue with the fiddling to try and get it starting and idling by itself.


    THANK FUCK it runs!

  3. #123
    Chopped BigMuz's Avatar
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    Good one man.
    Retard Honour Wall.
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    Rob Sloth Young did i ask for your opinion? no. i only want it for a paddock bomb. go play with traffic.
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    you stupid fucken imbicle.
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    your are a fucken idiot of the highest level.

  4. #124
    Registered User I'm DJ!'s Avatar
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    Congrats
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  5. #125
    Registered User smithbro's Avatar
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    Great news. Skid vids ASAP!

  6. #126
    Registered User AlexinPerth's Avatar
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    Awesome!

  7. #127
    sack riding 10sec rx7's Avatar
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    Nice work
    im a cunt
    and apparently i dont know shit...

  8. #128
    Eurotrash :D
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    you said the bodies are modular. does that mean adding 2 more is do able? thinking 6 pot

  9. #129
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    yeah that'd be doable. I'd only be concerned with the strain on the first few linkages, but it should be simple to overcome that with some brain power.

  10. #130
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    2 months in I got time today to fiddle. I now have the timing in the ballpark and a working 1 bar map sensor.

    The engine is starting and idling pretty decent. Wb02 is working and the auto-tune seems pretty powerful for a sub $400 ecu.

    I need to properly sync the ignition and continue working on the base map.

    Huge progress, my brother is wrapped!!!

  11. #131
    Registered User 9triton's Avatar
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    rapt ?- or he is a christmas present ?

    good stuff - like this thread

    lol : edit wiki tells me 'wrapped' is informal australian

    carry on
    Last edited by 9triton; 16-12-14 at 10:05 PM.

  12. #132
    Purist, whats that? Jason Broadhurst's Avatar
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    Things I thought of to check Tim/Ant;

    All 4 injectors are firing nicely – look in the runners and do an injector test or just short out the injector driver to ground at the ECU for the two channels at a time. Pulse it too not just on or off.
    All 4 plugs are firing – crank car over with plugs on an earthed surface and record it on a phone which can do slow motion and watch back. It should be easy to see if healthy as it just alternates 1-3 then 2-4.
    Check cam timing – rocker cover off (leaking anyway) and do a crude dial gauge on the crank to see when #1 is opening and confirm correct. You're going to need a protractor but just print one online.
    Balance the throttles – I use a (manometer) 4m clear tube of water or milk between number one and number two, then leave number one as the reference and balance 3 against 1 and then 4 against one. Keep 1 as reference or you can add error along the way to all and then 4 is miles off from 1. You can also use a wind speed pitot or turbine thing from ebay (5 bucks).

    If all that comes up good, we need to work out what is happening on the triggering side of things. I'll bring my scope again and check the crank trigger against injectors and ignition outputs. My money is on a mechanical issue though.
    Jason Broadhurst

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  13. #133
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    Fuel and Spark - Will check both those things.

    Cam - The cam can be installed in 1 of 3 places. We re-installed the cam (after the BHG) to the stock location. What specifically am I looking for?

    Balance throttles - This is something we should have done, but needed the car running. I'll get onto this as well.


    I'm looking into any ways to filter the VR signal, or any advantages to using different firmware as well.

  14. #134
    Chopped BigMuz's Avatar
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    KISS, take out plugs and do a thumb test.
    Retard Honour Wall.
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    Rob Sloth Young did i ask for your opinion? no. i only want it for a paddock bomb. go play with traffic.
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    you stupid fucken imbicle.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fondles
    your are a fucken idiot of the highest level.

  15. #135
    Purist, whats that? Jason Broadhurst's Avatar
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    There is compression Muz, just this strange miss and splutter across the rev range. It's like the cam timing is too advanced, or ignition etc. Spurious fire before top dead or well into exhaust stroke.

    The more I think about it, the more I suspect it's triggering issues. It's going to be 6 weeks before I can scope the crank trigger against ignition to ensure that it is consistent though.
    Jason Broadhurst

    Someone once asked me if they could use my mower. I said "sure, so long as it doesn't leave my yard"

  16. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Broadhurst View Post
    There is compression Muz, just this strange miss and splutter across the rev range. It's like the cam timing is too advanced, or ignition etc. Spurious fire before top dead or well into exhaust stroke.

    The more I think about it, the more I suspect it's triggering issues. It's going to be 6 weeks before I can scope the crank trigger against ignition to ensure that it is consistent though.
    Yeah probably another 6 weeks before I wanted to help again too. In that time I'll explain he needs to get rego sorted.

  17. #137
    Pro Game Dev (pennywise)'s Avatar
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    Doing this to my other datsun, but bought a set of Individual Throttle Bodies to mount on the DCOE manifold ,
    No Power chips thanks

  18. #138
    That's Sir Cunt to you... krisr's Avatar
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    What wires are used for the VR sensor? Unless it's a shielded pair with the shield grounded at the ecu end you'll be pulling out your hair. Are you 100% sure you have the correct input capture edge? Easiest way to check is to change the timing from table to fixed advance, give it a rev and if timing advances when checking the balancer with a strobe you are on the wrong edge.

    I forget, is this a distributor or crank trigger?
    Last edited by krisr; 10-02-15 at 08:38 PM.
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  19. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by krisr View Post
    What wires are used for the VR sensor? Unless it's a shielded pair with the shield grounded at the ecu end you'll be pulling out your hair. Are you 100% sure you have the correct input capture edge? Easiest way to check is to change the timing from table to fixed advance, give it a rev and if timing advances when checking the balancer with a strobe you are on the wrong edge.

    I forget, is this a distributor or crank trigger?
    Crank trigger.

    Hes on the verge of getting it registered so we can experiment with stuff. Lots of diagnostic plans to figure it out.

  20. #140
    sack riding 10sec rx7's Avatar
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    Needs to be on falling edge if reluctor pickup
    im a cunt
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  21. #141
    That's Sir Cunt to you... krisr's Avatar
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    Yeah that's generally how I wire up VR's too, but I remember there was something funky with the VR inputs on Megasquirts (especially production microsquirts) and I think the signal was inverted in circuit so the processor saw a rising edge trigger. The best way to test this on MS ecu's is to set it to "fixed" timing of about 15*, hold the timing light on it and give it a rev, if it advances with RPM, the MS edge is wrong in software. Fucked I know, but it's just a tip that i've picked up over the years.

    <thread jack>BTW Dale, dads Pontiac wagon will probably be coming down to you guys for a new set of pipes. The mufflers are fucked and the pipes are about 20 years old now... I'll probably book it in for the old boy soon, cash permitting... </thread jack>
    Last edited by krisr; 16-02-15 at 06:03 PM.

  22. #142
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    yep, that's exactly how to check triggering. Also make sure you're set on VR triggering and not Opto triggering, that's a hardware change.

    Send me a three-minute datalog of a warmed-up idle, a slow rev, and a snap-throttle rev (if it'll do it) and the MSQ file and i'll do a little remote tuning for you, I have lots of L-series maps to crib from.

    Stock cam profile?

  23. #143
    Purist, whats that? Jason Broadhurst's Avatar
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    I seem to recall falling on the scope, I even took a photo to show/record tim. I wouldn't have left it as rising edge either way being VR
    Jason Broadhurst

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  24. #144
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    Just checked, trigger set to falling. I took a log if anyone is interested.

  25. #145
    That's Sir Cunt to you... krisr's Avatar
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    Yeah put it up with the msq, did you try to fire it up and check timing like I suggested before? You may be wired for falling edge but the circuitry from memory will invert the pulse so the CPU sees the other edge. Confusing head fuck but easy to verify.
    Last edited by krisr; 26-02-15 at 04:27 PM.
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  26. #146
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    Confusing only if you didn't build and configure the system...Microsquirt qualifies. On Megasquirt V3.0 and V3.57 boards you select inverted or normal, so you can run either way.

    Looking at symptoms, may check for correct triggering, I.e. trigger angle and such. refresh us on how your VR is triggered?

    May just swap your VR wires too, but uusually if they are swapped it will sputter and cough, but not run.

  27. #147
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    So to be clear, once past the 'stumble' the engine will pull through the rev range. We have a 36-1 wheel with a Ford sensor. I have no reason to believe the polarity of the sensor is backwards. If it was backwards it would idle like it does, or pull through the rev range like it does?

    We did some work to the engine in the last week.


    Rewinding back to when this had carbies. We found the headgasket had failed on cylinder 3 and pushed itself out the side of the head. We replaced the head gasket and did the EFI conversion on the car. About 2 weeks ago my brother noticed a rattle in the engine. He took off the tappet cover to find a head bolt bobbing around. Removed the bolt and found a coil of threads from the block still attached. This bolt was right above where the gasket blew the first time. Too much cylinder pressure or borked install, we don't know.

    So we decided to pull the motor, remove the head, helicoil the block, replace the gasket, fit ARP studs, and put a new timing chain/tensioner/guides on the motor. That has all been done. When re-timing the cam, I timed it 4 degrees retarded to where it was before to see if that made a difference. It is much better , but still has the hesitation. It is happier to drive at 60/80 etc without the pig-rooting it had before

    I'm working on another crank pickup arrangement using a stock datsun dizzy housing with Magna internals. I'll experiment with this setup as well.

    At the moment we are just glad we can get
    Last edited by tim510; 17-03-15 at 10:17 AM.

  28. #148
    Registered User I'm DJ!'s Avatar
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    progress - this is my favourite pf thread at the minute, keep at it mate.
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  29. #149
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    any progress?

  30. #150
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    Still running, but not properly. Engine is coming out again to get properly dialed in this time by someone who knows more than me. Brother has found work and been busy for the last 6mths so things have been on the back burner.

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