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Help with recovery point bolt spacing - D40 and 200 series

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    #16
    Originally posted by takai View Post
    as lots of others (100 series etc) ... cant be mounted further back because of where the leaf shackles sit.
    Originally posted by Sloth View Post
    fit 80/100 one backwards
    As above, foul on leaf shackles.
    Chris
    ------
    The new nugget
    I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself. - D.H.Lawrence

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      #17
      Originally posted by irsa76 View Post
      From the guys that have attempted it they reckon the bullbar brackets interfere with aftermarket recovery points. I haven't looked into myself, not really a priority for me at the moment.
      Sorry I thought you meant it was impossible for the aftermarket to rate recovery points. I think your vehicle was pre- rated recovery points at TJM. The ones they do rate to 8,000kg are pretty stout and they’re welded into the winch frame.


      OP be very wary of recovery points that weren’t tested on a vehicle. Testing in one direction on a rigid fixture is not realistic and you might end up with a 16mm plate coming your way.

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        #18
        Originally posted by lukevl View Post
        OP be very wary of recovery points that weren’t tested on a vehicle. Testing in one direction on a rigid fixture is not realistic and you might end up with a 16mm plate coming your way.
        That is what margins of safety are for.

        For what it is worth, this is what we are after:
        http://www.trail-tailor.com/store/p9...00_Series.html

        Just without the massive import costs from the US. Its a 60mm bolt spacing.

        Oh and these are the existing 'load rated' recovery points:


        If anything is going to be breaking and flying off, im going to bet its those...
        Chris
        ------
        The new nugget
        I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself. - D.H.Lawrence

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          #19
          Originally posted by lukevl View Post
          OP be very wary of recovery points that weren’t tested on a vehicle. Testing in one direction on a rigid fixture is not realistic and you might end up with a 16mm plate coming your way.
          Are _any_ recovery points that aren't OEM, rated/tested on a vehicle?
          Parramatta Eels, 2009 Premiership rightful winners.

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            #20
            Originally posted by MartyHusseinXF View Post
            Are _any_ recovery points that aren't OEM, rated/tested on a vehicle?
            I'd hazard a guess TJM and ARB test on vehicle since they already do physical crash tests for the bullbars.

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              #21
              Originally posted by takai View Post
              That is what margins of safety are for.
              Yeah, no. I have seen independent tests of some and they rip out of the mounts below 5t. And I have also load tested recoveries and seen over 6t. The maths suggests margin of safety will remove a part of your frontal lobe.

              If you recover properly and carefully you'll probably never have an issue. Just hope you never get stuck and the next person to come along isn't some yee-haw in a boosted 4Wd showing off to his mates after 8 cans.


              Originally posted by MartyHusseinXF View Post
              Are _any_ recovery points that aren't OEM, rated/tested on a vehicle?
              Yes. You don't have to do it every time but if you validate your process on a vehicle then test on something that replicates the OEM vehicle it's pretty safe. But there is a lot more to it than that such as what loads you test to, angle of pull, and most importantly pass criteria (allow deflection etc)

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                #22
                Originally posted by irsa76 View Post
                I'd hazard a guess TJM and ARB test on vehicle since they already do physical crash tests for the bullbars.
                Most- if not all- companies physically test their bars (for airbag compatibility) but not necessarily using a complete vehicle chassis

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                  #23
                  Originally posted by lukevl View Post
                  Yeah, no. I have seen independent tests of some and they rip out of the mounts below 5t. And I have also load tested recoveries and seen over 6t. The maths suggests margin of safety will remove a part of your frontal lobe.
                  Any mount will do that then, and without any option specific to this vehicle it becomes an exercise in ticking a box.

                  Still doesn’t help with getting a mount that fits
                  Chris
                  ------
                  The new nugget
                  I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself. - D.H.Lawrence

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                    #24
                    Originally posted by takai View Post
                    Any mount will do that then, and without any option specific to this vehicle it becomes an exercise in ticking a box.

                    Still doesn’t help with getting a mount that fits
                    Well no not really. The generic looking 2 bolt ones aren't great. The good rated recovery points pick up on multiple bolt holes on multiple planes. If it were me and the club were being dicks about wanting a sticker I would make my own very hefty recovery point, and bolt on some garbage yellow two bolt version with a 4t label on the other side. Then make sure no one ever hooked onto the shit one.

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                      #25
                      Originally posted by lukevl View Post
                      Well no not really. The generic looking 2 bolt ones aren't great. The good rated recovery points pick up on multiple bolt holes on multiple planes. If it were me and the club were being dicks about wanting a sticker I would make my own very hefty recovery point, and bolt on some garbage yellow two bolt version with a 4t label on the other side. Then make sure no one ever hooked onto the shit one.
                      Any 'garbage yellow two bolt version' still needs to fit up to the stock bolt holes... so we are back where we started, looking at bolt spacing for D40s and 200 series... :knock:
                      Chris
                      ------
                      The new nugget
                      I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself. - D.H.Lawrence

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                        #26
                        Ah right I didn't realise there were only 2 holes in the chassis. A lot of newer cars have very few substantial bolt holes so the recovery points reach further back to spread the load over a larger (more substantial) area- often picking up on generic holes using crush tubes and the like. Or in the case of the TJM bars they use the winch frame and spread it across both chassis rails.

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                          #27
                          Originally posted by lukevl View Post
                          Ah right I didn't realise there were only 2 holes in the chassis. A lot of newer cars have very few substantial bolt holes so the recovery points reach further back to spread the load over a larger (more substantial) area- often picking up on generic holes using crush tubes and the like. Or in the case of the TJM bars they use the winch frame and spread it across both chassis rails.
                          Sure, all of which can be done with a custom winch bar later on. For now he needs to simply put a load rated recovery point on there to tick a box and keep the VicRoads/club rego people happy.

                          Anyway, seems that 200 series are 60mm spacing on the front bolts, but too long overall, and D40 are 75mm spacing.
                          Chris
                          ------
                          The new nugget
                          I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself. - D.H.Lawrence

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                            #28
                            takai, over thinking the most simple shit since 1992.

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                              #29
                              Do the regs say it has to be on the front of the car? What about a recovery hitch in the tow receiver?

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                                #30
                                Originally posted by tim510 View Post
                                takai, over thinking the most simple shit since 1992.
                                Nah, just want to minimise the ordering and return process. Its not a hard job. What seems to be hard to comprehend for some people is the need to sometimes meet pointless regulations.

                                Originally posted by lukevl View Post
                                Do the regs say it has to be on the front of the car? What about a recovery hitch in the tow receiver?
                                Recovery points need to be at both ends of the car. You really think we didnt check that? :w:
                                Chris
                                ------
                                The new nugget
                                I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself. - D.H.Lawrence

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