Open wheeler racing in Aust

[EfiOz]

This might sound lame but Im just not interested in comitting to a national series again, Id do a Victorian one. The costs of a National series are just silly.
Given that, what could you run it in State series wise?

These engine rebuilds...what are they worth?

Also, whats this thing seriously worth?

PM me. We talky.

[EfiOz]

Some of those rebuild costs sound a bit on the low side, an aquaintance with a Speiss unit, was told 15k. I'm guessing airfreight to and from Germany and possibly euro v oz at the time might explain.

We do our own engines in house. To send it back to the UK will set you back 15K every time.

And don't trust just anyone to rebuild one, no matter what credentials they think they have. These are very tricky little gadgets.

[Old Major]

If you want affordable wings and slicks racing, probably the best options would be an Australian Formula Two (AF2) car from the late 70's up to the mid 80's. Brian Shead's Cheetahs dominated during this period, but there were a lot of different manufacturers such as:

Arbyen, Argus, ASP, Avanti, Birrana, Bowin, Brabham, CBS, Cheetah, Chevron, Crabtree, CRD, Dallara, Elfin, Hardman, HTG, Kaditcha, Liston, Lola, Lotus, Magnum, Mantis, March, Mildren, PBS, Ralt, Renmax, Reynard, Richards, SAM, Sirch, Van Diemen, Wren.

These cars are typically an aluminium monoque, which makes the tub a lot easier to repair than a carbon tub. They are also very light weighing in at about 400kg plus driver plus ballast.

The engines are production based up to 1600cc, single cam and 2V per cylinder, with an 8500 rev limit and making up to 200hp. Typical engines include the VW Golf, Toyota 2T (Celica) or Holden Gemini and a new motor will cost about $10k, with rebuilds considerably less.

Transmissions are usually the Hewland Mk9 or VW based Holinger, which are pretty cheap compared to most transaxles.

Tyre and brake wear is very low due to the low weight of the cars.

Lap times are similar to V8Supercars for many racetracks and are on par with the newer AF2 Dallaras and Reynards. For instance, last years AF2 Championship was won by a Cheetah and is this years is being lead by a Cheetah.

These cars can be raced in the NSW AF2 Series with a flat bottom, or in the newly formed national Formula-R series with either a flat bottom or ground effects. Formula-R runs in with OZBoss. If a certificate of description is obtained AF2 cars can also be raced in the numerous Historic races held around Australia. Hillclimbs and sprints are another possibility.

If you only plan on racing in Formula-R, the cars can be re-powered with a 2000cc 16V VW-Golf motor which make a lazy 200hp with a 7000 rpm rev limit and only cost $5K new.


Links:
Australian Formula Two Club: http://home.exetel.com.au/dogwomble/

Formula-R: http://www.formula-robertson.com/

Cheetah mk7 for sale. These cars are a very simple design and are considered to be ideal to learn in as they are very forgiving. They are also very competitive. http://www.my105.com/classified.asp?id=6933

[Old Major]

Know of a Supersport coming up for sale shortly, 1100 kawa powered, dry sumped, couple of seasons use, not sure how much he is after.

If you look at some of the F2 lap records, some seriously quick cars there - I'm assuming BDA rather than Golf powered and attendant rebuild costs. Of couse you could always shoot for the stars (Gold).

If it's BDA powered it's a Formula Atlantic/Pacific.

[gxxr]

A bit of a thread archaelogy.

We do our own engines in house. To send it back to the UK will set you back 15K every time.

And don't trust just anyone to rebuild one, no matter what credentials they think they have. These are very tricky little gadgets.

Don't suppose you know offhand if the bores are nikasiled or similar? That bloke in SA says no, inspection through the plug 'ole suggests otherwise.

If it's BDA powered it's a Formula Atlantic/Pacific.

My bad, come into contact with a guy from time to time who had one in the mid seventies - pre-Pacific, my assumption was BDA powered as per international series. Turns out they were a Ford twin cam 8v and had a nasty habit of turning themselves into component parts at great expense and at the earliest opportunity, hence the adoption of sohc and rev limits.

Those lap records I mentioned, were set in a Golf, probably a reflection of more than a little driver ability, larger fields and drivers not in their 50's and beyond!

Back on topic, sports racers at least, the rumour mill suggests 6 of those West jiggers have been sold - one guy buying two. AMRS 1, CAMS 0 ??

[EfiOz]

Yes, some manufacturers do use Nikasil with very smooth bore finishes. Depends on who and what year.

[Nafe]

Ferrari 430GT, Lambo Gallardo GT3, Aston Martin DBRS9 > Wests

[gxxr]

Yes, some manufacturers do use Nikasil with very smooth bore finishes. Depends on who and what year.

Ta for that, still doubt he'd spring for it even if it's confirmed. At least judging by the guesstimate for the replating from the motorcycle mob down your way.

Ferrari 430GT, Lambo Gallardo GT3, Aston Martin DBRS9 > Wests

Dunno, for several hundred thousand more I'd be expecting warp speed not level pegging (with a couple of exceptions) or getting my arse handed to me.

http://www.natsoft.com.au/cgi-bin/re...06/2007.QR1.Q6

http://www.natsoft.com.au/cgi-bin/re...05/2007.QR1.Q7

[Nafe]

And for much less I can buy a SuperKart and go faster again.... what's your point?

[EfiOz]

Back on topic, sports racers at least, the rumour mill suggests 6 of those West jiggers have been sold - one guy buying two. AMRS 1, CAMS 0 ??

Talking to the factory guys they say they're not taking any more orders until the end of the year as they can't keep up now.

[Old Major]

My bad, come into contact with a guy from time to time who had one in the mid seventies - pre-Pacific, my assumption was BDA powered as per international series. Turns out they were a Ford twin cam 8v and had a nasty habit of turning themselves into component parts at great expense and at the earliest opportunity, hence the adoption of sohc and rev limits.

The cars with Lotus motors are now highly sought after as they produce decent power and are considered relatively reliable and affordable to build.

[gxxr]

Talking to the factory guys they say they're not taking any more orders until the end of the year as they can't keep up now.

The side-effect of a rising dollar? If and when they get a standalone series, wonder if they would permit a parallel import West or half brother 1st gen Stohr, looking at past 2nd hand sales < 50k landed should be achievable.

And for much less I can buy a SuperKart and go faster again.... what's your point?

Despite perceived cache and I'll grant you a nice exhaust note and an attractive body in some cases, end of the day, you are racing a converted road car at great expense, with all the compromises that entails. I'd refer you to Billzilla's earlier entry in this.

The SuperKart is a great idea, problem is most of us don't maintain the body of a 20yr old indefinately on the road to decrepitude. With all the general aches and pains of advancing years, the addition of a bruised rib cage after a weekend is something the more mature :D among us try to avoid.

The cars with Lotus motors are now highly sought after as they produce decent power and are considered relatively reliable and affordable to build.

According to him, with the added incentive of prizemoney, they were turning them fast to get the edge over the next guy.....of course, everyone else had the same idea. Usually story, when you are most able to race, don't have the available resources.

[Nero]

The thing about the west cars, well made though they are, is that they are not eligible for anything apart from the somewhat contrived AMRS sportscars and their own series. They do not meet the FIA def of a sportscar due to the central driving position and the supersports will never want to hear from them. In effect they are a single seater with bodywork.

[Rz]

The side-effect of a rising dollar? If and when they get a standalone series, wonder if they would permit a parallel import West or half brother 1st gen Stohr, looking at past 2nd hand sales < 50k landed should be achievable.

ill throw some pics in here because i think these cars are super cool
west

stohr

[Nero]

How can they block a private import?