GM faces rapid collapse without aid

[padey]

You are probably only looking at the Germans, Japs and Swedes for better quality.

Swedes? First time i've seen swede and quality used together.

[RESON8]

It is not as easy as saying let one of the big 3 fall America, if one falls most likely they all will. They are saying 1 in 10 people in the US work in jobs directly linked to the auto industry, it will be a very scary if they do fall
It shits me that the US government will pay big money to bail out banks who in turn make money off the tax-payers by charging interest but wont bail out the auto industry who employee 1 in 10 people.

If manufactures go under who are the only suppliers to a particular market it will take a long time for anyone else to fill the void. No auto maker would have the money or balls to invest in new programs to fill these voids in the current situation.
If GM do go under it will be very interesting to see what happens to Holden and the ties with Pontiac and G8 sales as a large chunk of Holden’s production is US bound G8's.

Quality wise Holden have increased dramatically over the years, I would have never considered getting an earlier commodore but the VE/WM series have changed my thinking. Like any brand people have pre perceived opinion of the commodore based on past dealing, it will be hard to change the opinion of these people.

The old man got a new Mazda 6 the other month I picked up heaps of build faults like trim gaps, severe orange peel, scratches to interior plastics, deep scratch to rear window, rattle from within dash the worst was a discoloured edge to the paint on the roof where you could see where the shipping protective plastic had not completely cover the panel. He was happy to live with these issues which is what I find typical for a Mazda/Honda sort of buyer but when it comes to them looking over a local product they will pick on every fault.

[Beavis]

Just because one of the big three 'fails' doesn't mean there won't be any holding companies that come in and try to pick up the pieces -- like what Cerberus are essentially trying to do with Chrysler (and failing ).

If one of them goes under, someone smart will buy the pieces and try to resurrect the brand(s) -- presumably with things like new labor contracts (hopefully without the UAW's involvement) that will put them on a hopeful foot to profitability. The rest of this "omg 1 in 10 Americans will lose their jobs!!11oneone" stuff is bullshit scaremongering.

[BENN0]

No one will fill the RWD, V8 Aus market. Becuase it is so minute on a global scale it is not worthwhile.
Holden pump out 110k vehicles in a year. Roughly 40% V8s. So lets say 50k V8's per year. Ford about half of that.
So small that no one will worry about it.

Everyone is so quick to bag a Holden/Ford but ignore the fact that thier supreme Euro machine has less features, is slower, of similar quality and more expensive to buy bits for.

Aus has the most variety of cars avail for purchase than nearly any country on the planet. The competition is massive. Tarrifs are next to nothing, all OEM's are moving to low cost countries (even the ultra premium Euros), we buy a minute ammount of cars a year etc etc.
Its a huge challenge.

[St00ge]

http://www.time.com/time/business/ar...,00.html?imw=Y

Interesting article from a couple of weeks back basically saying Ford are in the best position to survive with no bailout as it had close to $20 billion cash in the bank at the end of the third qtr this year while the other had alot less and burning through it like there is no tomorrow.

[padey]

No one will fill the RWD, V8 Aus market. Becuase it is so minute on a global scale it is not worthwhile.
Holden pump out 110k vehicles in a year. Roughly 40% V8s. So lets say 50k V8's per year. Ford about half of that.
So small that no one will worry about it.

Everyone is so quick to bag a Holden/Ford but ignore the fact that thier supreme Euro machine has less features, is slower, of similar quality and more expensive to buy bits for.

Aus has the most variety of cars avail for purchase than nearly any country on the planet. The competition is massive. Tarrifs are next to nothing, all OEM's are moving to low cost countries (even the ultra premium Euros), we buy a minute ammount of cars a year etc etc.
Its a huge challenge.

Come on brother, what you are saying doesn't fit with my experiance.

The V8 lexus and bmw's i've owned were at least one generation ahead in features, as fast or faster and heaps better quality then the falcon and commodore of the time.

[Buck Nasty]

Come on brother, what you are saying doesn't fit with my experiance.

The V8 lexus and bmw's i've owned were at least one generation ahead in features, as fast or faster and heaps better quality then the falcon and commodore of the time.

....and 4 times the price.

[MickyD]

No one will fill the RWD, V8 Aus market. Becuase it is so minute on a global scale it is not worthwhile.
Holden pump out 110k vehicles in a year. Roughly 40% V8s. So lets say 50k V8's per year. Ford about half of that.
So small that no one will worry about it.

to put that in perspective, BMW built 280,000 MINI's last year....

(oh, and I actually think Holden built more like 220,000 cars)

[Billzilla]

....and 4 times the price, mainly due to the HUGE import duties forced on us by the government.

Fixed.

[Buck Nasty]

That's crap, the M5 costs 50,000 pounds in England, yet $220,000 here, that's not the Government, that's BMW. This is a small market, they will only send X amount here a year, so they put it at a price that will sell that X amount. Because of this they are then placed in the luxury car bracket, and are then taxed.

BMW, Lexus, Mercs and Audi's are considered top end brands here, where in Germany (except Lexus) they are used as Taxi's, so they jack the price up in Australia to keep it that way.

[Billzilla]

That's crap, the M5 costs 50,000 pounds in England, yet $220,000 here, that's not the Government, that's BMW. This is a small market, they will only send X amount here a year, so they put it at a price that will sell that X amount. Because of this they are then placed in the luxury car bracket, and are then taxed.

BMW, Lexus, Mercs and Audi's are considered top end brands here, where in Germany (except Lexus) they are used as Taxi's, so they jack the price up in Australia to keep it that way.

Nope.

[bumpstart]

i might just rush out now and secure a TATA franchise

[GHaST]

As much as a lot of people want new cars, really we have enough cars. People are just caught in a rut where we need to upgrade.

its like mobile phones, its a money making circle that we require a new mobile phone when at least half the time the old one is still fine for its purpose.


If people have no money, do you think the first thing they think of is upgrading their car? not really. so the amount of new cars needed will not go up again, until people have money again.

[dhs]

the current Skyline 370GT is a very very expensive car - it's the infiniti g37 in the US

you are kidding yourself if you think this is acceptable

I can only see someone like Hyundai able to come to the table with a <$50k RWD car

Bring on cheap Korean V8s coupes...
Hyundai Genesis anyone?

[Dave]

Just because one of the big three 'fails' doesn't mean there won't be any holding companies that come in and try to pick up the pieces -- like what Cerberus are essentially trying to do with Chrysler (and failing ).

If one of them goes under, someone smart will buy the pieces and try to resurrect the brand(s) -- presumably with things like new labor contracts (hopefully without the UAW's involvement) that will put them on a hopeful foot to profitability. The rest of this "omg 1 in 10 Americans will lose their jobs!!11oneone" stuff is bullshit scaremongering.

+1

Personally I think they need to fail to clear the massive monkey on their back, otherwise they are going to be a gigantic incinerator for the USD