Open Speed Limits for NT?

[TTerror]

The whole thing about German roads being far superior is a sham. Hlaf the autobahn was as good or shitter than roads like the Geelong or M1.

It comes down to culture, responsibility and training and Australia is plain shit and its too late to do anything about it. Just like U.S has decided that guns are a part of its national character and is basically impossible to change that now and forever, Australia has collectively (govco & majority of citizens) that we are shit cunt drivers and will never ever change the licencing system, driver training or bring about cultural change about the way we use our roads. That shit requires bulk money, voters will never approve licence testing costing $1000+ and gov will never give up speed camera revenue WHICH IS AN INTEGRAL PART OF THEIR ANNUAL OPERATING BUDGET.

[Shifty]

As I've said before, it's only a matter of time before some lawyer or rich cunt loses a family member, and sues go co/police minister/police dept for criminal negligence or similar

[rj_astra]

gov will never give up speed camera revenue WHICH IS AN INTEGRAL PART OF THEIR ANNUAL OPERATING BUDGET.

how much do fixed speed cameras contribute to the NSW coffers?

[Billzilla]

how much do fixed speed cameras contribute to the NSW coffers?

I read somewhere that 10% of them had broken down last year and that's why we have a TWELVE BILLION DOLLAR DEFICIT !

[Buck Nasty]

how much do fixed speed cameras contribute to the NSW coffers?

I know in Vic a few years ago it was $440 million (all speed cameras that is).

[Captiva Fan]

I know in Vic a few years ago it was $440 million (all speed cameras that is).

Victoria was about double NSW too.
They'd be raking-in a fair bit more now, with the red-light ones & so many more school zones on major highways where they don't belong etc etc.
Even a few years after all these fallacies started the amounts were irrelevant in terms of state budget; they probably can't afford to lose it as a revenue stream now.

Can anyone point to a well researched study on this topic?

It just occurred to me; you don't hear anything much of new studies being done, do you?
The purposely mis-interpreted studies from the 70's & 80's said that the safest speed was what the 85th percentile would do without any limit, and then force everyone to do that speed; X percentage under that speed was exactly as dangerous as X percentage over that speed (obviously removing the extremes that such a tiny tiny number of drivers have ever been involved in & yet which are inaccurately portrayed as the drivers causing us all to be targetted). The 85th percentile speed was about people not running off the road or losing control, and the plus-or-minus X was about people not running into each other; which all makes sense.
That 85th percentile was slow then; it'd be even slower now, with modern cars & modern power & modern brakes/suspension.
But I don't recall having ever seen anything that specifically measured the trade-off between fatigue due to a higher speed, and fatigue due to a longer drive. As I just typed that, though, it did occur that the aforementioned 85th-percentile speed is probably a pretty good sweet-spot in terms of fatigue because it's comfortable; slower is more stressful due to both impatience & time spent on the road, and faster is more stressful due to an uncomfortable level of concentration.

[rj_astra]

But I don't recall having ever seen anything that specifically measured the trade-off between fatigue due to a higher speed, and fatigue due to a longer drive. As I just typed that, though, it did occur that the aforementioned 85th-percentile speed is probably a pretty good sweet-spot in terms of fatigue because it's comfortable; slower is more stressful due to both impatience & time spent on the road, and faster is more stressful due to an uncomfortable level of concentration.

NSW gets about 50M from redlight and 50M from fixed speed cameras.

You can find studies on fatigue.. but they rarely mention speed as a way to reduce it. They also study the monotony of a road. Apparently our brain starts to switch off after just minutes driving - lol This is made worse by long straight roads with constantly changing/varied roadside scenery (ie... long straight country road). If well rested then fatigue starts to set in after 2-2.5hrs. When that happens drivers usually do one of two things. Speed up to attempt increase risk and sensory inputs, or slow down to increase safety buffers around them. Neither works to any degree and the only solution is to stop and have a break.

They did a study in france where they took non-professional drivers and made them drive 1000km from 9am to 7pm. All they did was force them to take 3x15 min breaks and one 30 min break. Drivers arrive at end of test with no significant fatigue.

[MickyD]

I know in Vic a few years ago it was $440 million (all speed cameras that is).

It's something like 10 times what the entire state of California (the 9th biggest economy in the world...) brings in.

[ls400x]

I propose speed cameras be converted to seat belt cameras for a more beneficial impact on safety based on the stats in the OP.

[rj_astra]

Some Vic stats

During FY2010/11, the Victorian government received nearly $250 million dollars ($249,716,864) in revenue from fixed and mobile speed and red light camerasx

In Victoria, it was revealed that road safety camera fines, police on-the-spot fines and toll road evasion fines generated $256.9 million, $125.7 million and $109.7 million in revenue respectively, in 2011-12vi.

[Greg Rust]

I wrote a letter to some minister cunt in WA asking why 100% of redlight and speed camera fines wasn't spent of the road trama fund thing, they eventually got back to me 9months later and said that in that time it had been changed to 100%.

You other state cunts should do the same, if it's not 100%, then what is that money being spent on?

[TonyJZX]

general revenue

[132oft]

^^^Are you suggesting that someone would deliberately pull out in front of a car travelling at speed just to be a cunt?

Yes.

[TTerror]

I wrote a letter to some minister cunt in WA asking why 100% of redlight and speed camera fines wasn't spent of the road trama fund thing, they eventually got back to me 9months later and said that in that time it had been changed to 100%.

You other state cunts should do the same, if it's not 100%, then what is that money being spent on?

Everything. Like I said it goes into consolidated revenue, that is the shared bucket used for the state budget which clearly shows traffic enforcement is viewed as an integral income stream. Loosing that would be a major hole in the state budget, there is simply no incentive for any change of thinking from government. To make things worse its a self perpetuating cycle as the revenue funds advertising, propaganda and biased research to support itself and there will never be any competitive funding to go towards an opposition campaign to change peoples thinking.

Like many things in Australia, if you dont like it go somewhere else. And I say that as car loving hoon with money to burn on my hobby.

[jzx83]

snip ... But I don't recall having ever seen anything that specifically measured the trade-off between fatigue due to a higher speed, and fatigue due to a longer drive. As I just typed that, though, it did occur that the aforementioned 85th-percentile speed is probably a pretty good sweet-spot in terms of fatigue because it's comfortable; slower is more stressful due to both impatience & time spent on the road, and faster is more stressful due to an uncomfortable level of concentration.

Well said Forg, you expressed what I was trying to say. Another way of looking at it would be that 85th percentile is kind of the 'common sense' speed limit, where the people doing the driving on that road have arrived at that speed as a best trade off between being the motorist who arrives late and being the Late Motorist.

The problem with this is you're still having to share the road with muppet australian drivers. In the rare event that one of them actually uses a mirror and sees you coming at an elevated speed, they are then 11ty times more likely to pull in front of you for no reason other than to slow you down because fuck you and your faster speed than I deem to be safe.

The level of driver education here is lacking so far behind what should actually be required is fucking laughable.
.

I don't even think it is the speed nazi vigilante half the time. Some of them just seem like they can't stand to be overtaken, regardless of how safely it is done. Either way it is a cunty thing to do and assumes vastly more knowledge of the driver they are blocking than they can possibly possess. Such as is that a plainclothes cop I am blocking? or an angry ice head?, or even someone belligerent enough to say 'fuck him, let the impact happen'?

Like many things in Australia, if you dont like it go somewhere else. And I say that as car loving hoon with money to burn on my hobby.

See, my problem with that is that we are the boiled frogs. This has crept in over time and evolved our country from a place that admittedly was probably a bit too lax on a few rules and the application of them, to a place that is now completely over governed and over regulated to the point that it is affecting the culture and the quality of life. One of the reasons I love getting away to South Africa every few years is that the reality of speeding fines is that they may be issued, but you can generally ignore them quite safely. I drive there with a lot more vigilance than I do here, because the standard of drivers there is fairly low, not to mention risk of car jacking etc. The thing with ignoring speeding fines is essentially because the public service there couldn't find their arses with both hands, but they also have a bit of a freedom thing going which seems to mitigate against the type of over regulation that we are being subjected to here.

Surely we can find a happy medium between being free but getting murdered / killed in multicar pileups / carjacked etc, and being wrapped in regulatory cotton wool past the point of suffocation and much of the time to no real benefit.