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ICE vehicle values once EV's reach price tipping point. Slow decline or fiscal cliff?

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    #91
    I don't think $3/L would stop many people (refer Europe), but if the only people buying petrol are going on a Sunday drive every 3rd week it's going to be more like $30/L.
    Soft roaders represent an excellent compromise between the needs of the hardcore 4x4 user and the convenience of a city hatchback. Its clear to see why they have become so popular in todays society.

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      #92
      Originally posted by chartreusehj View Post
      There are probably stupid rules around storing "bulk" fuel at home and I don't ever see decent drum fuel being cheaper than pump but denatured ethanol isn't particularly expensive and I'd happily buy a dirty old ute that doesnt run and fit a "long range" fuel tank of around 200l if it skirts those rules.

      Realistically though, for the amount of miles I put on my car, 3 bucks a litre isnt going to stop me putting some fuel in it and cruising on a saturday afternoon and with the US being the last bastion of freedom, fun and doing what you feel there is no way petrol based fuels are going away anytime soon.
      Diesel will be around for a very long time yet. E HV vehicles do not make sense for the forseeable future

      Sent from my SM-N960N using Tapatalk

      Originally posted by Babalouie
      Geez we're a bunch of softcocks...we have a 911 and we're obsessing over non-functional ducts and indicator colours

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        #93
        Originally posted by vet 180 View Post
        Diesel will be around for a very long time yet. E HV vehicles do not make sense for the forseeable future
        It makes me very much wonder about how the UK has just walked it's ban on new ICE sales for private vehicles (including hybrids) forward to 2030.
        The airlines are probably hoping they can hold out for the next 10 years, because after that nobody's gonna be able to drive more than about a 200km range from home ... either that or there will be massive hotels set up for overnight stays every 400km along the Pacific & Princes Highways.
        Soft roaders represent an excellent compromise between the needs of the hardcore 4x4 user and the convenience of a city hatchback. Its clear to see why they have become so popular in todays society.

        Comment


          #94
          Originally posted by Captiva Fan View Post
          It's been all over the joint, I checked Fuel Check just now, and in a 5km radius it's between 1.349 & 1.659 ... I don't think I've seen weekly random regular variations between ~1.199 and ~1.749 before, ever.
          paid 1.05 yesterday for 91.

          No you cannot store fuel at home in bulk unless you have the right gear if you want insurance.

          .... because every driver experiences the destructive potential of the effortless surge of power available through the smallest of body movements.

          Dr Hoon
          .

          DrNick is king!!!! No, Mark Webber is now! Long live the king!... hold on a minute mate, Ricci is in charge now

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            #95
            Originally posted by nastysven View Post
            paid 1.05 yesterday for 91.
            I was talking about car fuel, not mower fuel.
            [which doesn't really work either because who runs a petrol mower any more?!]
            Soft roaders represent an excellent compromise between the needs of the hardcore 4x4 user and the convenience of a city hatchback. Its clear to see why they have become so popular in todays society.

            Comment


              #96
              Originally posted by Captiva Fan View Post
              The airlines are probably hoping they can hold out for the next 10 years, because after that nobody's gonna be able to drive more than about a 200km range from home ... either that or there will be massive hotels set up for overnight stays every 400km along the Pacific & Princes Highways.
              A friend of mine is a physicist who works in the alternative energy industry - they're making big noises about hydrogen energy. Easily transported, quickly transferred into vehicles (or anything else). A patchwork of electric for short trips and hydrogen for longer might be what happens.

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                #97
                Originally posted by Captiva Fan View Post
                It makes me very much wonder about how the UK has just walked it's ban on new ICE sales for private vehicles (including hybrids) forward to 2030.
                The airlines are probably hoping they can hold out for the next 10 years, because after that nobody's gonna be able to drive more than about a 200km range from home ... either that or there will be massive hotels set up for overnight stays every 400km along the Pacific & Princes Highways.
                Only if you assume there will be no further battery or motor tech improvements for the next 10 years

                Also i dont know why people are freaking out about the new car ban - even the pro-ev groups admit 2/3rds of cars on the road in 2030 will still be ICE. Its not like banning new cars suddenly makes the millions of existing vehicles disappear.
                Originally posted by Jim
                I feel that rules are important as without rules there is no cheating and cheating is a vital part of drag racing.

                Originally posted by elfturbomax
                What has happened to PF? It seems to be diesel love now days. Maybe the name should be changed to Particulate Forums.

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                  #98
                  Originally posted by perthdrivers.txt View Post
                  Only if you assume there will be no further battery or motor tech improvements for the next 10 years
                  I had exactly that in mind. For example, lookit the original Leaf, released here in 2012 so probably 2011 in Japan? Close enough to 10 years old. And if we then apply the same amount of change from then to now for another 10yrs, it doesn't get me to Mount Isa to visit Auntie Boo.
                  Soft roaders represent an excellent compromise between the needs of the hardcore 4x4 user and the convenience of a city hatchback. Its clear to see why they have become so popular in todays society.

                  Comment


                    #99
                    Originally posted by Captiva Fan View Post
                    It makes me very much wonder about how the UK has just walked it's ban on new ICE sales for private vehicles (including hybrids) forward to 2030.
                    The airlines are probably hoping they can hold out for the next 10 years, because after that nobody's gonna be able to drive more than about a 200km range from home ... either that or there will be massive hotels set up for overnight stays every 400km along the Pacific & Princes Highways.
                    Yeah for private vehicles it wont make too much of a difference. In the next 10 years a lot if infrastructure will get put in place and people will just stop a 1/2 hour to charge every 200kms. Which will be good for the little tourist towns and road saftey.

                    A lotvof people think it will be the battery tech itself that will make leaps and bounds in the next 10 years, but it will be the infrastructure of counties that does. People seem to think battery tech is in its infancy while ice is at its end if life cycle, but the fact is battery tech has been heavily progressing over the past 40 years in other sectors that give a far better roi than the automotive sector

                    Sent from my SM-N960N using Tapatalk

                    Originally posted by Babalouie
                    Geez we're a bunch of softcocks...we have a 911 and we're obsessing over non-functional ducts and indicator colours

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by Captiva Fan View Post
                      I had exactly that in mind. For example, lookit the original Leaf, released here in 2012 so probably 2011 in Japan? Close enough to 10 years old. And if we then apply the same amount of change from then to now for another 10yrs, it doesn't get me to Mount Isa to visit Auntie Boo.
                      The Tesla Model S has improved its range by about 50% since its 2012 release. At ~650km now, even allowing for a reduced rate of tech improvement and the difference between theoretical and real-world ranges, i think we'll be ok
                      Originally posted by Jim
                      I feel that rules are important as without rules there is no cheating and cheating is a vital part of drag racing.

                      Originally posted by elfturbomax
                      What has happened to PF? It seems to be diesel love now days. Maybe the name should be changed to Particulate Forums.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Backmarker View Post
                        A friend of mine is a physicist who works in the alternative energy industry - they're making big noises about hydrogen energy. Easily transported, quickly transferred into vehicles (or anything else). A patchwork of electric for short trips and hydrogen for longer might be what happens.
                        Hydrogen has a lot of things going for it, but "easily transported" definitely isn't one of them.
                        Norbie!

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                          Ha ha - you'll note that I'm not the physicist. Perhaps he meant 'relatively' compared to shipping electrical energy overseas. His basic thrust was Australia can generate bulk renewable energy and export it even if there's a lot of inefficiencies in liquefying and shipping it.

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                            Sending Hydrogen anywhere is a right pain in the proverbial. Converting it to NH3 (Ammonia) and sending that is far more practical was to send 'energy' around the world. Not sure what you lose at each end in energy consumption for the conversion process however. Bit like the whole idea of pumped hydro to store excess electrical energy. You lose a fair % on the energy conversion, but it works and is proven.

                            It's something to keep an eye on at least for now.
                            Last edited by 200MPH; 20-11-20, 02:24 PM.

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                              https://carbuzz.com/news/porsche-dev...bustion-engine

                              Porsche throwing 20 million euros at alternative carbon neutral gasoline

                              Sent from my SM-N960N using Tapatalk

                              Originally posted by Babalouie
                              Geez we're a bunch of softcocks...we have a 911 and we're obsessing over non-functional ducts and indicator colours

                              Comment


                                Japan also condidering a ban on ICE vehicles (mid 2030's). Domino effect?
                                https://www.reuters.com/article/us-j...-idUSKBN28D044

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