Diffferent

[Shitbreak]

Didnt the front of the VK first appear on some sort of Opel? Perhaps that was IRS?

Here it is:
http://www.bilhistorie.no/e70/lav331.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opel_Senator

Looks pretty much the same as the chev.

[Sturmovik]

The VL Brock Director had IRS (plastic Pig) and so did the ultra rare Brock Monza .

[BigMuz]

There you go. I thought the Commodore was substantially changed from the opel, but maybe I am wrong. Panels look exactly the same, bar the bonnet and front guards.

If that was the case then the American one might have been the opel exported. That explains the irs...

[bugle]

You say that like you think they were built everywhere. I'm not sure. Other than the opel which shared a few bits, I am pretty sure the Commodore is Australian built only. That Chevy would have been exported and finished in the states I reckon?

It's made in Seth Efrica according to the build plate pictured in the ad. Assume they were also built in the UK (Vauxhall Viceroy), Germany would've made the Opel Commodores. it's basically a GM global car like the Gemini was.

[Asteroid]

That's pretty nifty. I've heard of a few foreign Commodes around. Would be nifty for a project.
Also on that note, iirc the foreign models used a steering box.

Asteroid

[Nitephyre]

The basic design of the original eurospec Opels was lengthened and widened some for the VB-VL commodores to make the car larger for the .au market.

Essentially the VE is the first original Holden design NOT 'enhanced' from an Opel design.

And this coming from a non-Hold'n nut like me... There's shedloads of info on the intarweb about the Opel Rekord, Senator & Commodore

[bugle]

VB-VL are the same dimensions as their Opel counterparts because they thought Australians would want smaller cars. But Ford kept up the big cars and did better so Holden then went and made the VN bigger than the Opel equivalent.

[Peter...]

I thought Holden had to do a shitload of chassis strengthening and stuff to the VB so that the Opel didn't fall to pieces on our quality roads?

[rj_astra]

I think you find that the VB Commodore is a mixture of the Opel Rekord and the Opel Commodore of the 1970s. The long bonnet of the Commodore(as seen in the ad) mated to the body of a Rekord. That's why it had a live rear axle of the Rekord and the rack and pinion steering of the Commodore

The long bonnet wa simply to house the straight six engines. The engine in the car in the ad is probably the 3L unit (approx 2.9L).

[bugle]

Oh yea here's a fully sick short nose Rekord with a pic of the live axle http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2304045

Looks like the Germans did the same thing as us though with their Commodore with the Senator front on the Rekord body.. http://www.historisk-opelklub.dk/Med...modore%20C.htm
http://www.historisk-opelklub.dk/Med...mmodoreC81.htm

[BigMuz]

lol at the cardomain one

model 80, pearl white, velvet interiors, all stock, fully restored, carshow entry...

Nice work there, especially the numberplate that has been wrapped around a tree at some stage :D

Sideparkeringslys - Would these come from ebay?

I learnt a lot. Thanks guys.

[edo]

I owned (& crashed) an 81 Opel Monza...the coupe version of the Rekord. It had the same IRS as the VQ statesman in design but nothing was interchangable. It had recirc ball steering & the bonnet was the same length as a commo from VB-VL.

It came with a 3 litre straight 6...which was sort of like a longer starfire but with EFI. It looked nothing like that SA one.

Oh, there were more Opel Monza's produced than Holden Commodores, so they hardly qualify as rare...in Australia yes, but they were nothing special in Europe.

[GTSBoy]

The VB Crummydore has much much stronger turrets in the front inner guards to stop the front end falling off. When Holden's pushed one of the Opel cars around their rough road test track, the front end literally fell off within a couple of thousand kms (equivalent to maybe ten times that distance out in the real world). The turrets just got punched straight up out of the bonnet.

The lightness of build of the Opel cars explains why the VBs etc used to like cracking parts of the chassis, like the Panhard rod bracket on the passenger side. I don't think they upgraded that bit.

There is a long history of this sort of thing. Back when Ford brought in CKD kits of the XM (?) Falcon, they had to add those braces from the top centre of the firewall out to the inner guards to stop that falling apart too. The American cars didn't have them.

cheers

[edo]

GTSBoy, Ive read all that too...its BS. The front end in the monza, actually the whole body was much much stiffer & stronger than any commodore up to VL. The chassis rails in the front were bigger, the x member was different (different steering) & stronger. The distance between the strut tops was closer on the monza & the inner guards & towers were double skinned. Jack up one corner of the monza & 3 wheels came off the deck, doors openned...no early commodore I have ever seen had that sort of chassis rigidity. Im afraid, Holden got hold of the Opel & built it cheaper.
Also despite what everyone says, virtually nothing was interchangable, everything was just slightly different. You could look at it (whatever part you liked) & swear it was the same as a commodore, you get the commodore part & it just didnt fit.

So, from 1st hand experience & unlimited frustration I can tell you 100% that what you read about the commodores being stronger & better cars just absolutely is not the case. Of course, holden & the local media are never going to say this...but think about it, the Opel competitors in its domestic market were Mercs & BMs...take a look at a 280se & compare the quality of that to a VB.

[GTSBoy]

Well, I did read that in an interview in Wheels magazine with Mr Hanenberger (sp?) who was over here with Holdens as a suspension and body engineer when they were doing the RTS mods to H and L series cars and developing the V series. I believed him at the time (seeing as he did the design work).

cheers